Biblical And Rational Responses To Homosexuality and Transgender
This is a follow-up thread to “Can a Person Self-Identify as a Homosexual and Continue a Gay Lifestyle and be a Christian?” and particularly to what LuckyInLove’s post and concern:
“I think most conservative Christians would agree with the blog post. However, it doesn’t address the root of the issue which is that the vast majority of homosexuals truly believe they were born that way, therefore it makes it not a sin. Many even get angry when it’s suggested that something happened in their life beyond their control, such as sexual abuse.
While we could argue that everyone is born with a sinful nature, they would argue that their homosexuality is about as sinful as being born with a disability.”
Here is a video from Pastor Voddie Baucham that gives a Biblical response to this concern. The video is 50:51, however, the time is well spent.
Finally got a chance to listen to the video. Overall it’s excellent. I especially liked his paedophile answer to “Jesus never said anything about it” because I just argued this issue with a Red Letter Christian.
The one error I think he made was in saying there is no biological link or proof of homosexuality. This is wrong, and evidence to the contrary goes back at least two decades. A brief but clear explanation of one such thing can be found here.
I will have to get to a coffee shop to get enough bandwidth to watch the vid.
Part of this issue is the fault of Christians. Years ago we taught, without any supporting scripture or science, that homosexuality was a choice. So if you are homosexual and you know you never made a choice to be that, what do you do with the “choice’ teaching? In large part “born that way” was and is an answer to “you chose to be”.
As with many other things, we promoted a lie as God’s truth, and it made God look bad and caused people to stop listening to us. [insert pet peeve icon here!]
I’ve studied this a great deal for many years. As best as I can tell, there are things that happen in utero that cause a predisposition to same-sex attraction. No genetic link has been found, but there is good evidence that hormones during pregnancy can do this. In some, it’s a weak predisposition, and life events tend to encourage or discourage it. In others, it’s strong and pretty much a given the individual will feel strong same-sex attraction. In some ways, this is like a disability, but calling it that won’t help the situation!
I don’t think any of this is contrary to what the Bible says. We all have a sin nature, this is just how it’s directed. Take two 15-year-old boys, one homosexual one heterosexual. One wants to have sex with a male classmate, the other a female classmate. Both desires are wrong and they should avoid acting on their desires.
I know homosexuals who have chosen celibacy. I respect and honour that choice. I also know homosexuals who have married an individual of the opposite sex and made it work. They develope a sexual desire for that one woman, and they focus their sexuality on her.
I apologise because I can’t get enough internet to watch a 50 minute sermon.
I do believe that someone can identify that they are only sexually attracted to the same sex and live a life as a follower of Christ. Each day choosing not to act on their attraction. Just the same as we ask of single heteros. I just can’t fathom how we have arrived at a point were the only proof that many will accept for conversion and following Christ is a hetero marriage with kids when we don’t expect it from heteros.
‘Christians’ screaming Gays will burn is an abomination. And I mentioned on the other thread, if a gay person says ‘I have always been gay’ then you take them at their word. Trying to come up with a ‘reason’ that suits your interpretation of the Bible is just offensive. Some on here will remember Job on the old boards. One of his sons is gay. No ‘reason’. No ‘sexual abuse’. Just born that way. Digesting that for Job was incredibly difficult. How Jobs son has acted on that – he is in a relationship and looking at marriage to a man – is the sin.
I have not watched the message either because I am visiting family and I don’t have the time to sit and watch it. But in response to other comments and to the idea in general, I will say this:
First John shows that if anyone lives a habitually sinful lifestyle, no matter the sin, he is not in Him.
1:6- If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;
2:3-6- By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 5 but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: 6 the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.
3:9-10- 9 No one who is born of God practices [habitual] sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot [habitually] sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.
5:18 – We know that no one who is born of God [habitually] sins; but He who was born of God keeps him, and the evil one does not touch him.
BUT we can’t miss the thrust of this letter, and each person needs to do a self-check….
4:11-13- 11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. 12 No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us. 13 By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.
4:20-21- 20 If someone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for the one who does not love his brother whom he has seen, cannot love God whom he has not seen. 21 And this commandment we have from Him, that the one who loves God should love his brother also.
5:14-16- 14 We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death. 15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer; and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 16 We know love by this, that He laid down His life for us; and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren
**from what I have seen in the discussions here, I don’t see evidence of “hate”, but I know it’s out there by those who claim to be God’s. And I know that it is the Lord who knows the hearts and not I… but we ought to seek Him for the truth of ourselves.