How long does it take you to initiate sex?
How long do you think about having sex before you ask?
Have sex on Saturday morning, Monday mid morning start thinking about having sex tonight. Get home from work, wife gets home from work. I ask “how was your day?” Reply “it was long and this happened and that happened and I am really tired.” I want to have sex but know that tonight is out by the way she feels.
Tuesday evening, both home from work, wife says had a good day got a lot done but I have a headache. I realize no sex tonight.
Wednesday evening, home from work, wife says I really need to get those family pictures edited and uploaded so the rest of the family will have access to them. I understand that sex is out for to night.
Thursday morning arrives I really want to have sex I may even wake up early and am somewhat ready ( if you know what I mean) iknow that waking her up early is not an option, we both get up at 4:45 am to get going on the day. Ok tonight I will initiate sex, yes I will. Evening arrives, both home from work I listen very intently to gauge how she is feeling and what type of day she has had. I determine that it is not a good idea to suggest sex I can not determine if the answer would be yes or no. Can’t risk it being no. So no sex tonight
Friday, I am really wanting to have sex but know we will probably have sex tomorrow so I just as well wait till tomorrow so I don’t seem like a jerk for asking now.
Saturday come around and if nothing else has come up we will probably have sex today.
Start the process all over again. So it takes me about a week to initiate sex and then only if I know the answer will be yes.
My wife has said to just ask!, but I emotionally can’t unless I absolutely know the answer is yes for a no is devistating to me. A no really means that I am not worth her time and attention.
Does anyone else live a life like me who is sexually frustrated most of the time.
“She knows what no does to me but says I need to get past that.”
Does she really understand? I remember reading a comment from Paul Byerly on a blog (I think it was The Forgiven Wife, but I can’t find the article) where he said something like “If she really knew what saying ‘no’ did to him, she’d never refuse him again, even the times when she should.”
The difficulty in initiating usually isn’t really understood until one has tried initiating–just read the first paragraph of DG’s initiating question. The difficulty is even more overwhelming when one has been rejected, especially rejected repeatedly. I’m sure that not all men are like this, but for me, being rejected felt like a part of me died, and I sometimes think permanent damage was done. Back in my dark times, I’d much rather be getting the “once every two weeks” sex that I thought was duty sex than to get a “yes” once every four days but getting rejected once each time between sessions. Give me a full prostate and the despair of suspecting my DW has no interest in me instead of the verbal confirmation in the form of a rejection, anytime. (Please note that much of that was in my head and things are much better now.)
That said, maybe a few options:
- Have you tried propositioning her at the start of the day for sex that night? If she has all day to think about it, things may go better.
- How often have you tried asking her when you think things are off the table?
- As others have indicated, can you schedule sex?
- Have you tried semi-sexual things (like a massage) as a lead in? With these, you may never have to “ask” because you can slowly migrate them into full-blown sex. She’ll never be put on the spot that way. Oh, and it might help on headache days.
- Is your wife amenable to being “taken” at times? Some women like that…again, it takes away them being “put on the spot”. If you don’t know if she’ll be okay with it, you may consider asking immediately after a sex session sometime…that way she won’t be pressured and is more likely to give a non-evasive answer (bonus points if she just O’d, as she’s more likely to be persuaded!)
- Finally, and this is crucial, how do you initiate? Do you just say “wanna have sex?” That’s basically a 100% “no” from my DW if she answers truthfully. But we’ve had much better luck with me asking “are you willing to be aroused” (or any other “are you willing…” phrases).
Hope that helps,
I have a few thoughts here based on all this.
1. I am almost certain that your wife doesn’t fully understand how hurt her denial makes you feel. The closest thing I can think of is to tell her that it’s similar to your turning her down for a conversation when something bad has happened and she’s desperate to talk about it. Even then, I think it’s worse because she can have a conversation with another friend. I’m the poster who recently tried to initiate but was turned down my husband. I can tell you, I thought I understood what it was like for you men, but I honestly had zero clue before it happened to me. It’s something to have a conversation about.
2. She may have scar tissue or something from birth. It happens. But as a female, it sounds to me like she may have been afraid to let go during sex. To me, what you wrote sounds like one orgasm and one near miss because she may not have recognized what she was feeling. It is often difficult for us to completely let go. I am pretty sex positive, but there are times when I just feel like I can’t let myself be culinary enough to enjoy it. It has a lot to do with needing to in control of myself on a busy day. If I let go during sex, then it means admitting I am not always in control. On those days, I admit that if I agree to sex, I am just going through the motions and feeling almost nothing. I’m learning to work around that, but it still happens.
I’m not saying for sure that’s what your wife is dealing with, just making an educated guess. Refusal of sex for us is often not about sex at all. And it’s rarely meant as a personal attack on our husbands We just don’t see it the same way. Either way, have a conversation with her about what you’re feeling.
Have you shared with your wife why you “just can’t ask” her, because of what a “no” does to you? Is she willing to work with you on making some changes on sexual approaches (i.e. scheduling, her not saying “no” when you initiate but if she can’t gives a “raincheck” for the soonest time possible, her initiating when she’s willing, etc)? Are both of you willing to communicate in a straightforward, direct and open way?
She says just ask.
This is good.
She knows what no does to me but says I need to get past that.
This is not the right heart.
Try to move to other days that sex is expected. Begin with “let’s add Wednesday” to the days of expected sex. In other words, sex on Wednesday is to be expected and effort is put into making it happen. If it doesn’t happen on Wednesday for example, then it happens on Thursday morning before work even if you have to get up early. Down the road, perhaps Wednesday can split into Monday/Thursday/Saturday. There is something really helpful about changing the expectation so there is an expectation of sex, and not is out of the ordinary.
Scott, Thank you for taking time to reply.
I will try to answer all your questions. Please forgive me if I miss something.
- If I were to suggest evening sex in the morning her response would be “I don’t know what I will feel like or in what kind of mood I will be in in evening”
- I do not initiate when I think the answer would be no. Don’t need to test fate.
- As an example I have been wanting to initiate this evening. I was going to suggest I take a shower and meet her in the bedroom. She just now jumped into the shower which means sex is out for tonight.
- We do have a loose Saturday morning schedule. But if there is an event or something pops up than its postponed to the next Saturday. Nothing beyond that. I don’t even know how that came about because it was nothing we discussed or planned it just sort of developed.
- The massage thing only relaxes her and maker her sleepy. And when she is sleepy you don’t think about sex. I’ve tried.
- The “taken” scenario would only be meet with “what the H… do you think you are doing?”
- Yes I have changed the way I initiate. It use to be asking permission. Now I try to be more creative. She NEVER is aroused so the question “Do you want to be aroused?” is a non starter.
I have, after all these year pretty much come to the conclusion that sex is of no real interest or importance to her. It is tough but once I realize that it did get a little easier. Just wish it wasn’t this way.
There you go Scott, Thank you for your time. I appreciate it.
sd595 Thank you for your responses.
As I told scott we did not set out to schedule saturday sex it just developed. I think she felt a little guilty and sort of figured if we have sex once a week that maybe I would feel better. As far as actually scheduling there is the mind set that she won’t know how see will feel then and what mood she will be in or if there will be another conflict arise.
If my husband felt like that I would absolutely want to know, like get the whole picture. If she doesn’t understand your desires, then she can’t love you in the way you are looking for. I am sorry you don’t feel safe enough to share your feelings with her Mon-Fri. I would encourage you to lead with bravery and vulnerability in sharing your heart, even though it puts you at risk. By the tone of your post, it sounds like she has good will toward you and isn’t trying to reject or hurt you. If that is true, being vulnerable (not accusatory) will likely have a favorable outcome.
“She knows what no does to me but says I need to get past that.”
I have maybe a different take on this one everyone else. I think there should be room for your wife to say “not right now”. I would not feel safe, cherished, and honored in a situation where I couldn’t ever say no. I know that sexual rejection is highly emotional and I’m not trying to minimize your pain in any way, but maybe you should explore why a “no” is so devastating to you. If her heart is not to reject you, but just to also be heard, understood, loved, and respected, then maybe there are other emotional issues inside that cause to to feel so much rejection. There is a podcast Java with Juli podcast episode that talks about other emotions that men sometimes need to work through that was very interesting. It’s episode #275 with Jay Stringer. I don’t know if that is helpful for your situation so take it or leave it.
I hope that both of you can grow in sharing your hearts and honoring each other!
LIT56RD- One big problem is that your wife likely does not understand how important this is. There are a good many wives who simply do not understand what you go through when you starve in this area. I think a frank and honest discussion that tries to convey this is always an important, but a difficult conversation to have. She needs to understand that once a week on Saturday is already 1/3rd of what you really need. The fact that if it doesn’t happen on a Saturday happens that she thinks it can go to the next Saturday just shows that she really has no idea of the importance. It can be hard to turn this around because she may think that what you have now is perfectly normal and again, she has no idea of what you have been going through because you haven’t communicated it to her. I know you don’t want to have this conversation with her, but for things to improve you will have to. There are two issues here, she can’t fix what she doesn’t understand or know, and she may not want to make the changes required to fix it. Both are going to take work on both of your parts.
Thanks for the quick response. It helps a lot for putting things in perspective.
I looked at your profile and saw you’ve been married 42 yr, wow. So I’m guessing she’s fully post menopause. Was she this way when she was younger? Has she ever felt sexual pleasure to your knowledge? Just trying to get more info to work with.
My wife had a complete hysterectomy many years ago. There has never been many menopause symptoms. She says that having delivered 3 babies vaginally everything changed in the feeling department. I think one time along long time ago she had an orgasm. We just finished having sex and she had been quite vocal during and replied that she needed to be careful about doing that in a motel. One other time she told me to stop because she felt that if I didn’t stop she would have peed. Not sure if those classified as orgasms or near misses.